Several months ago I was listening to a local radio station when an old radio announcer called in and said he just heard John Lear had died. Can anyone confirm this?

Vic

: An Interview with John Lear

: 25 November 1989

: Welcome back. It has been a long absence.

: L: It sure has.

: Your absence has the public wondering what happened.

: L: Well, I was the host for the MUFON Conference in Las Vegas.
: There were about twelve speakers and we accomplished a lot.
: There was a lot of information given out. To my absolute

: surprise and shock I was called into the airline that I
: worked for, about five days after the conference. I met
: with senior airline officials and they asked me "You
: don’t really believe all this stuff, do you?"
: "Well, yes sir I do", I said. "Why?"
: they asked. I gave them about a ten-minute rundown on my
: research in the past three years and they said, "We
: just can’t have anybody who believes this stuff flying for
: our company. What if our passengers found out?". I was
: summarily terminated. It was a great shock to me. I had
: many, many years of seniority as a captain with this
: company. I had to get out and hustle for another job. With
: my qualifications, I didn’t have much trouble finding
: another one... it was a while before I got my life sorted
: out. During that time I haven’t had time to get involved,
: although I have been keeping abreast of the situation.

: I take it you were refusing any and all interviews during this
: period..

: L: Yes, I was so busy getting into the new job..

: Did you feel like you’ve been burned by your belief, in so far
: as you went public and lost your job?

: L: No. I just felt sorry for these people who have not keep
: abreast of the events and who really and sincerely believe
: that nothing is going on. I really felt sorry for them
: because they were so ignorant.

: One thing is absolutely clear. Something is going on. I would
: guess that you would say, "They are Here"...

: L: Yes. Beyond a shadow of a doubt. Since I last talked to you
: I have seen one. I was taken out to a desert test center by
: a theoretical physicist who worked directly for the Navy,
: and he told me, "We’re going to flight tonight. Would
: you like to see it?". I went out into the desert and
: watched it fly. It was kind of interesting, although it
: wasn’t a shock to me because I knew they were there. I said
: "So what else is now?"

: That would be Robert Lazar?

: L: Yes. We kept his name confidential for the year that we
: knew what he was doing. He came public here about a week
: ago on Channel 8’s two-week UFO special.

: You worked closely with Robert Lazar for a period of time. How
: much of that story can you tell us?

: L: Most all of it. There are some aspects of it that I cannot
: discuss to the public. You know what I am taking about.

: Yes.

: Is that area called Area 51?

: L: Well, Let me explain that what is known as the Test Site is
: an enormous area that borders between Caliente, Tonopah and
: Las Vegas. The very center of it called Area 51. It’s a 10
: mile by 10 mile square which is called by various names.
: It’s called Groom Lake, Watertown, The Area, The Spot...
: all kinds of different names... the Red Square and
: Dreamland are two more. A lot of secret testing goes on
: there. The U-2, the SR-71, and Aurora have been tested
: there.

: What about the Aurora?

: L: Well, the Aurora is the follow-on for the SR-71. It cruises
: at mach 10 and has a ceiling of 285,000 feet. It is a three
: man aircraft that was built by General Dynamics. It is
: methane powered and currently operates out of Groom Lake.
: There are a lot of other secret programs that go on up
: there. The area called S-4 is where the saucers are flown.
: It’s approximately 10 miles southwest of Groom Lake. This
: is where they kept the nine extraterrestrial saucers that
: the government works on under a Navy project. Let me tell
: you. There are a lot more saucers, but they are kept in
: various other areas. They are working on these specific
: disks in order to get some of the technology out of them.
: The technology is so far advanced that there is very little
: hope of us using any of it. The other saucers are kept at
: Wright Patterson AFB, Kirtland AFB, Homestead AFB... there
: are about five other bases that they’re kept at. The last
: one that they recovered – the one that crashed in the
: desert in Botswana in May 1989 was taken to Wright
: Patterson in June and then it was transferred to Kirtland
: AFB sometime this year. It is now presently at Kirtland.

: If a reporter wanted really convincing footage of a UFO, is
: there a place that he could go?

: L: Yes, they could go to the road to the east of Rachel,
: Nevada and shoot to the south. It’s at sunset that they
: fly, and there’s no problem. The problem is that they
: expect to get things in 15 minutes. Most of the reporters
: are young and are just getting into this stuff. They show
: the same films on television that they have been showing
: for the last 20 years. They often test on Wednesday nights
: at Groom Lake.

: Are you familiar with the F-117A?

: L: Yes, The F-117A is the Stealth fighter. It has been
: operational since 1981. The first derivatives of the
: Stealth have been flown since 1981. It is flown out of the
: Tonopah Test Range , which is in the extreme northwest
: corner of the test site. It was tested at Groom Lake, but
: it doesn’t fly much there anymore.

: What would you see if you went up there?

: L: You would see the same thing I saw when I was invited up
: there March 22nd. In the distance, it looked like a dancing
: light. When I looked at it through a Calestron telescope it
: was definitely a disk. I saw it and others also saw it.

: They have something up there.

: L: There’s no doubt about it. Bob Lazar took a lie detector
: test and he was on Channel 8. He told people what the
: propulsion was about. It uses gravity amplifiers. When he
: took us out there one time the security forces caught us.
: It was legal for us to be on BLM land, but they have these
: storm troopers out there that work for the government. They
: come out and harass you. They know they can’t legally kick
: you out of there but they can certainly make it
: uncomfortable for you. They made it uncomfortable for us –
: certainly for Bob Lazar. They terminated his job with EG&G
: the next day. When he showed up to work one of the security
: officers put a gun in his hear. It was an unpleasant
: experience, but that’s the way the government operates.

: One of the thing that Channel 8 pointed out is that all of a
: sudden Bob had no school records or records of employment.
: They had all been erased.

: L: Yes. He has two degrees from MIT. He attended Pierce
: College and Caltech. He worked at Los Alamos on the SDI
: `project. He is a very brilliant scientist.

: If he attended all these schools, what about diplomas?

: L: They exist. I’ve seen them. The only news media that has a
: full copy of all his employment records and all his degrees
: is the Review Journal in Las Vegas, and they called Los
: Alamos and received all that information Fedex in May 1989.

: What happens to Robert Lazar now? He is virtually a non-being.

: L: He has his own business locally in which he works every
: day.

: One time you stated that we have the alien technology and that
: we have the ability to study it in ome way. How does that
: jibe with the fact that we appear to be flying these disks?
: We are obviously mastering some of their technology to be
: able to go that far.

: L: Well, we can fly it but can’t build it. It’s as if you took
: a SR-71 and dropped it into a WWI air base. There are some
: things that we have built with the technology that we have
: attained, but these are airplanes that the public has never
: seen and probably will never see.

: Much of the media suggests that the alien are warm, fuzzy ET’s
: that are benevolent. It occurred to me that since they are
: here and they haven’t gone public, that they could just as
: easily be bad guys as good guys.

: L: That certainly what I believe. If they were good guys,
: don’t you think that the government would want to release
: information about them after 40 years of contact? Would
: they tell us why they haven’t cured cancer, etc? If this is
: going on then the government would want to take advantage
: and claim credit for advances in science and medicine, but
: this doesn’t seem to be the case. It is apparent to me that
: this particular group of aliens that the government made
: arrangements with are not a good group of people. We are
: being visited by approximately 70 different races. The
: government, in 1963, was aware of 17 species according to
: the Grudge 13 report. Since then, ther have been other
: species discovered. The ones that the government made the
: deal with in the late 1960’s, the ones known as the Greys,
: are the ones that are giving us a problem.

: What are some of the main types of species that are here?

: L: The trade of technology was made with the Grey skinned
: beings about 4 feet tall with oversized heads. They have
: the almond shaped eyes. They have the armas that come down
: below their knees. They have four fingers. Two are longer
: than the others and they’re partially webbed. They have
: claws on the end. That’s one type. There’s another type
: that’s about the same height with a more roundish type head
: and roundish eyes. These are the ones that are supposedly
: from Zeta Reticuly. We have ones that look like humans.
: There are all kinds of different ones. I have no doubt that
: some of those are friendly, but the ones we have the
: problems with are the Greys.

: If some of the aliens are bad and wish us ill will, then you
: could almost understand why the government must be in a
: desperate search to try and understand and duplicate their
: technology so that we could defend ourselves. Does that
: make sense?

: L: That makes sense, and that’s exactly what’s going on. You
: have to understand that this is the biggest and most
: important secret in the history of mankind. The people that
: are involved in this programs have to sign a security oath
: and also a piece of paper saying that they agree to give up
: their Constitutional Rights to a fair trial if they get
: into the program. That means if they divulge information
: they can be killed or committed for the rest of their lives
: to a mental institution.

: How does that bear on what Robert Lazar has done going public?

: L: Well, it’s only been a week since he made his statements.
: We’re waiting to see what happens.

: Do you think that some guys in black suits are going to walk
: in and...

: L: I dont’t know. His friends are worried about him. That’s
: where it stands.

: I bought the book "Alien Harvest" by Linda Howe, and
: its an excellent book that I would recommend to anyone.

: L: I would too. I spent a lot of time researching with Linda
: Howe and drove trough Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico with
: her on some of my research. She’s a very knowledgeable
: lady.

: You mentioned that she had information relating the Kennedy
: assassination and UFO’s, and I wonder if you could shed
: some light on that. She really didn’t cover it in the book.

: L: Well, to disgress a moment, there were two times that the
: Government was going to tell the people about the existence
: of flying saucers and aliens. The first time was in 1972
: when MJ-12 contracted Grey Advertising in Los Angeles and
: had them write a documentary which was called "UFO’s
: are Real". Robert Emmanegger was the man who wrote it,
: and he was taken to Norton AFB and shown still photos of
: the original film of the landing at Holloman AFB in New
: Mexico which occurred
: ........................................................and
: narrated by Rod Serling. It was essentially a whole history
: of UFO’s and at the end of the documentary they were going
: to have the actual footage of the saucer landing and the
: aliens getting out. What happened was Watergate. The powers
: to be decided that the public could not handle two
: traumatic experiences at one time, so they cancelled the
: release to the public, They did however, release the
: documentary. At the end they replaced the motion picture
: footage of the actual event with drawings. Rod Serling
: says, "let’s consider an event that may happen in the
: future or already may have happened". Of course it had
: happened.

: The second time the Government was going to let the public
: know some of what was going on was in 1983 when they
: contacted Linda Howe. Linda Howe was the go-between between
: MJ-12 and Home Box Office (HBO). She was to have access to
: 68,000 feet of motion picture film of disks, landing, etc.
: She was also to meet one of the aliens, designated EBE-II,
: who was kept at Los Alamos National Laboratories in New
: Mexico.

: I have since talked with a scientist who worked there and who
: verified that it was approved for her to meet the alien.
: For some reason, all of this did not come off and the
: project was cancelled. During the time that Linda Howe
: functioned as the go-between between MJ-12 and HBO, she was
: talked in more or less an effort to let her know how
: serious this was, that the powers to be had to eliminate
: President Kennedy because he wanted to release the
: information on the disks and the aliens in 1963. Since
: then, we have talked to people to have heard the recording
: made in the Oval Office when Kennedy pounded his fist and
: told the representatives of MJ-12, "you guys better
: get your stuff together because I’m going to tell the
: public".

: There are people who would suggest that this is just why he
: was assassinated.

: L: There were several reasons why he was assassinated. One was
: the Bay of Pigs fiasco, another was that he had threatened
: to "shatter the CIA in to a thousand pieces". A
: third reason was because he threatened to pull our all
: Americans from Vietnam by 1965. The fourth was that he
: intended to expose the alien-disk cover-up.

: A lot of people may not understand what MJ-12 is.

: L:
: ....................................................................................................................................................President
: Truman by Executive Order on September 24, 1947,
: approximately two months after they recovered the first
: disk near Roswell, New Mexico. Their job was to report to
: the President on the technology and maintain the cover-up.
: The group has been in control of every major decision in
: the United States since that time.

: Why has it been so long since a major incident like Roswell
: has come into the public eye?

: L: It shows the extent and effort put into the cover-up.
: They’ve done one hell of a job.

: How far have we flown the craft that we have?

: L: I don’t know for a fact. I assume from what I have heard
: that we have gone to the Moon and several of the planets. I
: say that because a friend of mine has seen photos taken on
: mars which indicate that there are cities, with buildings,
: doors and windows.

: Recently there was a reported sighting in the Soviet Union
: where several entities approximately nine feet tall emerged
: from a spacecraft. Where do these people fit in your
: catalogue of fuzzy people? Who in the Government appoints
: MJ-12 successors? If Mr. Lazar is committed by the
: government for telling what he knew, are the psychologists
: there sworn to secrecy too?

: L: I’m sure the Soviet sighting is credible. I have personally
: never heard of entities that are nine feet tall, although
: that does not mean they don’t exist.

: The last questions demonstrate some little knowledge of how
: the government works. MJ-12 appoints their successors. All
: of the original MJ-12 are dead. The last to die was Gordon
: Grey around 1983. We don’t know all the names of the
: current MJ group. I can give you some names of people who
: are heavily involved in the cover-up. One is Edward Teller,
: the so called "father of the H Bomb", who hired
: Robert Lazar to work at the Test Site. Dr. Teller is in
: charge of the disk program up at the Test Site.

: He’s also the father of the Star Wars program. How does that
: fit into all of this? Brilliant pebble.

: L: I don’t know anything about the Star Wars except that it
: does what it was designed to do but was finished in 1984.
: All the money that is being appropriated for Stars Wars at
: this moment is being diverted to other programs including
: the programs at S-4.

: If that’s so, it points to the desperate nature of the work
: going on at Area 51.

: L: That’s right. In answer to the last question about Robert
: Lazar if he was committed, the people who would do that
: would not employ people who would reveal the information.

: One of the persons
: who............................................................................time
: is Paul Bennewitz. We all know that he was the father of
: exposing all this stuff in 1979. He ran Thunder Scientific
: Corporation, who made temperature monitoring equipment for
: the Air Force. He leaves in Albuquerque, New Mexico. His
: house faced toward the Manzano Weapons Storage Area. He was
: the first one to get pictures of disks taken off and
: landing there at Kirtland AFB. He took this photos down to
: Kirtland and said something like, "hey you guys, look
: at what’s going on!". They were so shocked that it
: took them about six years to get him in an asylum. He has
: not done much since he emerged from there.

: If Robert Lazar has worked with this disks and he has signed a
: Security Agreement, as well as made the information. If
: they come to him in any way at all right now, won’t they
: just lend credence to his story?

: L: That’s what we would think. That’s what we are hoping –
: that he’ll be safe by making this statements. It will be
: interesting to see what will be happening in the next few
: weeks with Bob.

: Do you know if S-4 pumps out any frequencies that we can
: listen to?

: L: All communications there are done on VHF and UHF. If you go
: up there with a frequency counter and a scanner, you can
: find out what frequencies they’re transmitting on. The
: guards, up until last friday, transmitted on 138.3 but when
: they changed it when they found out that it was public
: knowledge. If you go up there and monitor UHF, you can
: actually hear them talking from the ground to the disks at
: 220 Megacycles.

: Have you seen an alien?

: L: No Sir, I have not.

: Have you seen a disk?

: L: Yes, I did see the one that government flew on march 22nd,
: and that’s the only one I‘ve ever seen.

: How big it was?

: L: Well, it was about three miles from where we were standing
: to the Groom Lake area. I’m not very good at sizes, but I
: would imagine that it had a diameter of from 30 to 50 feet.

: Is Tesla technology involved in this?

: L: I’m sure it is, but like I said, I’m just an airplane pilot
: and I don’t know about that stuff.

: What can you say about Forrestal?

: L: Forrestal was the secretary of Defense. He was one of the
: original MJ-12 team put together by President Truman. They
: say he committed suicide in 1950 but that was not the case.
: In fact, he was thrown out the hospital window with his
: arms tied behind his back.

: Who did it?

: L: Your guess is as good as mine.

: Can humanity handle all this? Wouldn’t religion and the
: economy be disrupted?

: L: It probably would, and that’s probably why it’s is a
: secret. Everybody that I have talked to about this...when
: they realize that this information may be true, their first
: question is, "well what about God?". After the
: George Knapp special and the Lazar thing, I haven’t heard
: of any suicides around Las Vegas.

: On November 24th NASA announced plans to have a manned mission
: to the moon for 30 days in the year 2001, and to establish
: a nuclear powered base on the moon as a stepping stone to a
: Mars flight. Comment?

: L: I hate to dissapoint you, but most of us are not going to
: make it to the year 2001.

: Why?

: L: If you listen to the tape made by Dr. Strecker on AIDS,
: which was created by government, seventy-five percent of
: the earth’s population, will be dead by 1996. They are
: going to try to keep the earth’s population at 25%. Look at
: the tape. It will tell you how and when the AIDS virus was
: made. Contact the Strecker Institute in Los Angeles for
: more information. The government will stop the virus when
: the population reaches 25 percent.

: How do you reconcile flying saucers and the idea of God?

: L: Well, if UFO’s are real, either God had something to do
: with it or He didn’t. If God have something to do with it,
: who built the flying saucers? If God didn’t have anything
: to do with it, who built the flying saucers? I know more
: about this, but it may be something the public should not
: know at this time.

: Do you mean we’re not ready to know it?

: L: No I don’t think so. It would be very frightening to most
: people, to say the least. The public has a hard time
: grasping the idea of flying saucers – how are they going to
: grasp the
: absolute...............................................................................................................?

: I was stationed at Kirtland AFB in Alburquerque, New Mexico?

: L: What year, sir?

: Between 1951 and 1953

: L: Those were very interesting years.

: I had a minor administrative position, but I was stationed
: with a unit that was dealing with flying saucers while I
: was there. My position didn’t allow me too much exposure,
: but my best friend who was stationed with me was involved.
: The thing I wanted to tell you was that I talked to a Tech
: Sergeant that was involved in the B-29 atomic program
: there. He told me that during the Second World War he saw a
: flying saucer disassembled at Norton AFB, and he was
: subsequently transferred to Aniwetok Island in the Pacific
: after it was discovered that he knew it.

: L: Norton AFB was a very important facility. It was the
: repository of most of the motion picture film that the
: government has on UFO’s and there were a number of disks
: kept there.

: The organization that I was with had thousands of feet of film
: that showed different kinds of flying objects.

: L: That’s very interesting. 1952 was a very interesting year.
: They flew over the White House during a two week period in
: the year.

: I have gotten ahold of a copy of the book called MATRIX. How
: much of that do you believe is true?

: L: There is a lot of very interesting information in that
: book. A great deal of it came right off my desk. If you
: could ask me about a specific document?

: How about the Krill papers?

: L: The Krill papers were written by the same person who wrote
: the MATRIX, and both he and I have done a tremendous amount
: of research, and he just used the name Krill because he
: works in a very sensitive position and didn’t want his name
: known. Those are basically his ideas.

: With the MATRIX and some of the others books I have been
: reading I think that it’s pretty scary and that some of it
: should be kept under wraps. I don’t think that the general
: public is ready for what I have been reading, anyway.

: L: Well, I agree with you there.

: This keeps coming back like a bad dream. There is something so
: dire and scary that the public can’t know. Is there a time
: in the future when you can tell it all?

: L: I don’t think we have much time for people to understand
: what’s going on. People should enjoy their life. The whole
: program of the extraterrestrials was the Organize and
: Pacify. Remember those two words. There is so much going on
: that there is no way to bring everyone up to speed.

: Is there more to the abductions than people report? What kind
: of trouble are we having with the Greys? Are they good or
: bad?

: L: The ones that the government is dealing with are the bad
: guys. There are good ones here, but apparently they aren’t
: directly a parte of what’s going on. If the ones were
: dealing with are good, why did they murder 44 scientists
: and 66 military members at one of the bases? I know someone
: who read that document; a document that discussed that
: particular incident, which happened in 1979.

: I presume this has been covered up.

: L: Certainly. I know one of the families of one of the people
: that was killed – Dr Gary Henderson, who testified before
: Congress. He worked for General Dynamics, and in 1979 he
: disappeared off the face of the earth. He was involved in
: that division of General Dynamics which deals with UFO’s.
: We looked for him and found out that he had been attached
: to a Top Secret detachment that was stationed up at the
: Test Site. He was one of those 44 scientists. The
: Government has a way of going to families and giving them
: money to "help them over their problems".

: Isn’t the Government murdering people by introducing AIDS into
: the general population?

: L: Well, yes sir.

: We can’t do anything about this?

: L: No sir.

: Will the earth be taken over by the aliens?

: L: I don’t know. One of the problems in this research is that
: I wish I had all the answers. All I’m telling you is that I
: know to be true. I will also tell you when I am
: speculating. As far as the AIDS things is concerned, I know
: that to be true.

: There’s nothing we can do about it? We just sit back and die
: at their leisure?

: L: Yes. It wouldn’t even remotely occur to people that people
: as high as the Joint Chiefs of Staff were involve in the
: murder of Kennedy – how are they going to understand the
: AIDS problem?

: I want proof. If we’re all doomed because of AIDS, there has
: to be way to reveal this, and once revealed begin to do
: something about it. You have to take steps. You say they
: have a way to cure it.

: L: Yes.

: Then there has to be a way to bring pressure to bear so they
: will bring out the cure before Genocide occurs.

: L: It’s not in the plan. The overall plan is to get rid of 75%
: OF US. You can’t go agains’t the plan. That’s what we have
: to put up with.

: Is there any approach to change this?

: L: You can tell people, but they are not going to believe you.
: They don’t even believe in flying saucers. How are they
: going to believe that?

: It would seem like people with such advanced knowledge as some
: of these aliens would be benign in nature. Apparently, I’m
: wrong.

: L: Yes sir, you certainly are wrong. As far as interchange
: between species is concerned, do you go out and talk to
: cows and try and relate with them and teach them
: mathematics, or do you just use them for food?

: Well, I don’t go out and talk to them, and I don’t use them
: for food – that much.

: L: What if I were to tell you that the planet Earth was just a
: farm.

: Ok, I can see that. Have they been doing genetic experiments
: with humans?

: L: Well, yes. In fact we are just one big genetic experiment.
: You don’t seriously believe that we came from the fish in
: the sea and just evolved in 16 billion years to what we are
: now. The chances of that happening are 20 quadrillion to 1.
: It just couldn’t happen.

: Astronomers have recently located an object in space... a
: pulsar...which they believe is hundreds of billions of
: years old. The discovery of this pulsar throws a monkey
: wrench into every theory of evolution.

: L: It certainly does. I can’t help wonder if they’re trying to
: get around to tell us the truth, but I doubt it, knowing
: what the truth is.

: How does the Secret Government stay in control and keep a lot
: of the wealthy people from knowing what’s going on?

: L: It’s a complicated question. The 13 major banks. The
: Rockefellers and Rotchilds – they know what’s happening.
: The Council for Foreign Relations knows. How do they keep
: the flying saucer thing secret? They do it with drugs and
: hypnosis. It’s very very sophisticated. It was developed
: starting in 1955. They do it by first drugging the person
: who is brought into the program in combination with
: hypnosis. They structure it so that when a person works in
: the project, he’s totally knowledgeable and conversant, but
: when he leaves, the memory leaves with him. The main reason
: that we found out what was happening to Bob Lazar was that
: we were probing using regressive hypnosis. He could
: remember going up there and coming back but he couldn’t
: remember some of the things that went on up there. He has
: very clear memories that were not affected by the hypnosis
: and the drugs of looking inside the disk at

: S-4, of seeing it flies, of working with the technology. There
: are a lot of other things that he was privy to that didn’t
: come out until we did the regressive hypnosis.

: We have live aliens up at Area 51?

: L: Beyond the shadow of doubt.

: If they are not necessarily friendly, and we are trying to
: discern what their technology is about as we fly their
: craft around...have we put the thumbscrews to these
: guys...have we even tried to communicate with them?

: L: We can communicate with them. We’ve had three over the
: years...EBE1, EBE2 and EBE3. They were named by Doctor
: Detlev Bronk, who was on the original MJ-12 team. EBE
: stands for Extraterrestrial Biological Entity. We’ve
: learned that they recovered one more live alien from the
: Kalahari desert in South Africa in may 1989. I have a
: five-page report from the South African Air Force that
: someone managed to steal from the country. They sent two
: C-5ª’s to.........................................,and the
: one live alien. Both C5A’s operate out of Wright Patterson.
: One has a controlled environment built inside the airplane.
: They can change the air to accomodate the aliens. The other
: C-5ª is equipped to transport the disks.

: Are you in a position to release any of the South African
: information?

: L: Its out there. Its been in the Nevada Aerial Research
: report.

: Have you seen Barbara Honnegger’s book, "October
: Surprise"? Do you agree with that?

: L: I not only agree with her...I sent her some of the
: information I has when I was flying in Cairo that supports
: what she’s saying. It’s beyond a shadow of a doubt that in
: october of 1980 the Reagan political group, before they
: were elected, cut a deal with Komeini in Iran to delay the
: release of the hostages for 76 days in return for the arms
: shipments. The reason I know that is I was part of the
: shipments in 1980 and 81.

: They sabotaged the helicopters that were sent in to ‘rescue’
: the hostages, too, didn’t they?

: L: They certainly did, but that’s only part of it.

: If there was even the tiniest shred of proof, wouldn’t the
: Democrats have used that to win the election?

: L: Well, there are certain reasons why they can’t do that.
: Some of them were part of it. I was there, and I was part
: of the arms shipments, other than running the guns
: themselves, so I know that it happened.

: You said that 75% of the population is scheduled to be
: eliminated by 1996. Is that by an AIDS virus contrived by
: our government?

: L: Yes. Our Government created the AIDS virus. It was
: introduced by the World Health Organization into Africa in
: 1972. The public is being told that there are 20,000 cases
: a year when in fact there are 5,000,000, and in fact that
: doubles every year, so by 1996 it will have reached 75% of
: the worlds population.

: Was this WHO thing part of a vaccination program?

: L: Part of the final vaccination series which
: ..............................., also introduced the AIDS
: virus.

: Could you elaborate about the face picture in Mars? You said
: at one point that there were buildings up there?

: L: Yes, I get my information from Dr. Brandenburg, who has
: been involved in the research that covers that area on
: Mars. He was initially hired by NASA to research that area.
: They terminated the research for some reason and he went on
: with a group that did it on their own. Its called the Mars
: Research Project. He gave a paper at the MUFON convention
: in July which was very very interesting. What he says is
: that it is clearly evident that those are not natural
: formations, that indeed they were formed by some
: intelligent group, and in fact that the city that lies to
: the southwest about 10 or 15 miles is and was a city for
: some kind of race that lived on Mars. He has quite a bit of
: documentation to prove it. and on my own end, I have
: somebody who actually saw some pictures that the government
: keeps secret that clearly shows that it is, in fact, a
: city.

: If the Star Wars program was finished in 1984, and they are
: still allocating money for it, why doesn’t someone tell
: them?

: L: You have to understand that there are two realities here.
: The reality of what’s really going on as far as the planet
: Earth is concerned, and there’s the reality that you are
: involved in, where you believe in Congress and you believe
: that they run the United States, and you believe in the
: branches of government and that they make the laws, etc.

: What you’re saying probably explains their behavior than
: anything else.

: You mentioned a couple of books one time that were important.
: What were they?.

: L: One is called Majestic. By Whiteley Strieber. The other was
: the MATRIX, which is no longer for sale. I don’t think
: there are any copies in existence other than the ones that
: were first published. Another book is "On the Trail of
: the Assassins" by Jim Garrison, about the Kennedy
: assassination.

: Is it possible that the aliens only see us as a source of
: food? Are there tanks with body parts at Groom Lake?

: L: The tanks are not at Groom Lake. They are at other
: underground bases, one of which is near Dulce, New Mexico.
: It is possible that some of the aliens see us as a source
: of food, but I don’t think that is the whole story.

: Are you hesitant to talk about this aspect?

: L: Yes.

: It is true that you are castigated by most of the so-called
: rank and file UFO researchers because of your statements
: about the negative nature of the aliens?

: L: They don’t like what I have to say. The rank and file of
: the researchers, MUFON and the like, they like to go out
: and drink a cup of tea and talk about UFO’s, but they
: really don’t want to know what’s going on.

: As I understand it, there is speed more than the speed of
: light. Can you comment on this? A second question would be
: whether the aliens can target whom they wish?

: L: Yes, you can travel hundreds of thousands faster than the
: speed of light without breaking the basic laws of physics.
: Bob Lazar could explain it perfectly. It basically involves
: thew folding of time and space. On the disk, or at least
: the one Bob was working on, they have gravity amplifiers.
: They pull one side of the universe closer, and then they
: turn it off and you’re there. It’s a difficult concept for
: most people to grasp. As far as aliens targeting a certain
: individual, we have evidence that they can and do. There is
: supposedly this thing where they have to have your
: permission to invade your privacy and most people
: apparently willingly give it.

: How much the Congressmen and Senators know about this stuff?

: L: Congress knows relatively nothing.

: How about the President?

: L: Our current President knows more than the rest because he
: was director of Central Intelligence in 1976. He was also
: involved in the Agency as early as 1960. So he has a little
: bit better input than Carter or Reagan. Carter couldn’t
: fulfill his promise to make UFO information known. Reagan
: has mentioned "what if we were attacked by alien
: species from outside the planet...wouldn’t it get us all
: together" five times in different speeches.

: Are all the governments included in this problem?

: L: The soviets know a little bit. They were invited to S-4 to
: learn a little. As Bob Lazar has said. For some reason,
: they were kicked off the program. He doesn’t know why.
: Gorbechev has said the same thing in his speeches about the
: threat from space.

: What about the idea that the government is trying to disarm
: us?

: L: My personal opinion, if I were a cynic, would be that they
: are in fact trying to disarm the public, so that when they
: make their final move that there will be no resistance.

: I have heard that there is film that distinctly shows a mining
: process going on on the other side of the moon. What do you
: know about that?

: L: That’s for sure. I know a person in Houston who flew on of
: my dad’s airplanes. He was shown by a NASA photographer one
: of the frames taken by Frank Borman on the back side of the
: moon on Apollo 8 of the mining equipment. The way he
: described it is that it was about three hundred feet long
: and it was shaped like a "T". It appeared like it
: was kicking up dust, like it was moving when the shot was
: taken.

: Who do you think would be involved in the mining?

: L: I don’t know.

: Presumably either the government or some aliens or a
: consortium?

: L: Possibly.

: To be told that there is this massive threat and then to be
: told that we virtually can do nothing about it absolutely
: wears on me.

: L: Well, come up with a suggestion. What would you like to do
: about it? Where would we start?

: I don’t know.

: L: In order to solve a problem, you have to understand the
: problem. If you can understand that our government was
: usurped and taken over by this small group of individuals
: starting in the early
: ..............................................we can get
: going. The problem is that most people still believe that
: Congress makes the decisions and the President runs the
: country. As long as they believe that, there is nothing we
: can do.

: Until they accept everything, they can’t start down the road
: to recovery?

: L: That’s right, and I don’t believe there’s any way you’re
: going to get the majority of the people to accept it.
: They’re too busy watching ‘Wheel of Fortune’ and being
: Organized and Pacified.

: Why do you continue to expose yourself, despite the fact that
: you lost a job and open yourself up to ridicule?

: L: I wish I had the answer to that question. I really do. I’m
: not on a crusade. It’s certainly nothing I wish to
: continue.

: Could you elaborate on the 44 scientists that you say were
: killed by the aliens?

: L: Yes. It was a story that came to me from two sources about
: two years ago. It was confirmed by someone who read a
: document up at the Test Site. Apparently in the late 1960’s
: we made a deal with whoever it was that we would receive
: highly advanced technology in return for covering up the
: existence of the aliens and what they are doing. We thought
: that we would get advanced weaponry that we could use
: against our enemies, but in fact it turned out that we did
: get a lot of technology that was non-weapon oriented. These
: scientists were working at a highly classified facility,
: and in 1979 they collectively came upon information which
: indicated that something really really bad was going on.
: What it was, specifically, I do not know. Maybe they found
: out about the AIDS plan. It became necessary for the aliens
: to eliminate these 44 scientists. Whatever it was that
: happened, 66 Delta troops were sent in and ended up being
: killed along with the scientists. The document my friend
: read was dated 1981, and that’s all I know.

: I’ve been told that 35% of the people in Africa are infected
: with AIDS.

: L: It’s more like 100%. That’s where it started. Africa’s
: gone.

: Were we in essence hoodwinked?

: L: I believe that to be true. Yes.

: So, we are stumbling around up at Area 51 trying to get
: something useful from the saucers. Do you have any
: information as to whether we’ve have actually realized
: anything of any use at all yet?

: L: No, because it’s too far advanced. It’s maybe 100,000 to
: 500,000 years in advance of our technology. Bob Lazar
: talked about the fuel, which is Element 115. Our periodic
: table of elements only goes up to 103, and we can only
: produce that element for microseconds using enormous
: amounts of power. For us to even think of making Element
: 115 is absolutely impossible.

: What is element 115?

: L: This is what fuels the basic power source. It drives an
: anti-matter reactor, which drives the gravity amplifiers,
: which supplies the propulsion. We can’t even figure out how
: it can possibly be made, but there it is. We have 500
: pounds of it.

: These aliens are using our planet. How does that relate to the
: universal mind?

: L: You’re pretty close to what Paul Davies, a brilliant
: British physicist said. He said: "a major assumption
: which goes into discussions of space colonization and
: interstellar communication is that biological intelligence
: in societies represent the supreme example of organization
: and complexity of matter. We have to face the fact that we
: may only belong to a transient stratum in a whole hierarchy
: of levels in organization and development". What about
: cows? Don’t we raise them and keep them happy just to eat?
: Why would we think that we would be any different for a
: higher level?

: Because so much of what you say probably scares the hell out
: of people, and then when you say that you can’t reveal the
: rest of the information, try to get us to understand why.

: L: Well, all you are talking about revealing is really the
: ultimate of what is going on, and there’s no reason to do
: that because most of the people don’t even believe the
: beginnings of it.

: It is somehow tied to religion, isn’t it?

: L: Absolutely.

: You say it is ultimate. Is it because you feel that the public
: wouldn’t understand it? Because you feel it wouldn’t do any
: good? That it would just stir up trouble?

: L: It’s just too incredible. If I blurted it out now and told
: you what I feel to be truth, it would be ridiculous. You’d
: say, "Oh, well that can possibly be, because of this
: and that".

: In other words, you feel that the truth is so far out of sight
: that people would discredit everything you would say.

: L: That’s basically it.

: I appreciate the explanation.

: How can people protect themselves if the aliens decide to take
: them?

: L: There’s no way to protect yourself.

: Can we pray?

: L: I don’t think that would do very much good.

: You have said that some of these beings are evil.

: L: Well, what’s evil? Is it evil that we raise cows to eat?

: Is there a forum somewhere in which you could reveal the
: information that you cannot now reveal?

: L: I doubt it. Things are happening so fast. I’m not involved
: in this any more.

: In other words, it’s such a done deal that there’s absolutely
: no point in revealing, pursuing it or anything else because
: there is nothing that can be done?

: L: I would say that that is an accurate statement.

: Damn.

: L: Can you tell me about some of the alien races? Could we
: look to some of the good ones for help? If this is as bad
: as it seems, it seems to me that our race and the
: governments that lead us would think about destroying the
: world before they would let us be food for somebody else.

: There are at least 70 alien races that we know of. There are
: millions more. Carl Sagan, when he was part of a
: Presidential panel, estimated that there are at least 1
: million races similar to ours in the universe. Why can’t
: the good ones help us? We made our deal with the bad ones
: and apparently there is some kind of agreement of non
: interference. In other words, we
: .........................., and we can’t make a deal and
: then say, "oh, we made a mistake, can you help us
: out?". Apparently, that doesn’t work.

: Would the government consider blowing up the earth to keep us
: all from dying? All I’m going to tell you is that I’m
: laughing inwardly because I know something you don’t and
: I’m not going to tell you about it.

: This must be very frustrating for you.

: L: I got to the point where I knew what was happening and I
: thought, "what should I do? Should I try and tell
: people? So I tried to tell them for a while, and it doesn’t
: work.

: To be in that 25% that will survive, do you believe that if we
: don’t have sex or only have safe sex that we will survive?

: L: Absolutely not. It has nothing to do with sex or venereal
: disease.

: Some will be spared and others will not?

: L: That’s exactly right.

: Are you considering any personal survival plan?

: L: No, all I’m doing is spending time with my family and just
: enjoying life.

: Are you the only one who knows the truth?

: L: Well, all the people involved in the cover-up know. There
: must be at least 100,000 people in the government. You have
: the secret government police force, which is the Defense
: Security system... there are probably 10,000 people in that
: group, which was originally for defense security... believe
: me they do al lot more.

: I have a couple things to say, and tell me if I’m wrong. The
: being that we know as Christ is an alien. The star that we
: celebrate at Christmas was a space ship. The Earth is
: already on a self-destruct mission with that Jupiter probe.
: The trip to the moon in 2001 that NASA was talking about
: will be for the survivors of this planet.

: L: Some of those comments are correct. Some of them I won’t
: comment on.

: I guess everyone will have to deal with what you’ve said and
: deal with it in their own way.

: L: Right.