From: Ambrovista@aol.com
Date: Mon Jun 11, 2001 11:44 am
Subject: Revealing the truth about OKC Part 2

Q: What was the real deal?

A: The reality is it was between 16 and 18 feet in diameter. We've proved
that and clearly show that in our report. When they had this FEMA-sponsored
group of American Society of Civil Engineers come in and do their report,
they wouldn't let them get any closer than 200 feet. And they fed them
information, including the 32-foot crater. They said then it was 28 to 32
feet. They fed them the information to produce this report. They didn't let

them come on and do a hands-on inspection.

Q: What ever happened to all the contemporaneous videotape that KFOR and
others collected the day of the tragedy. I can still remember hearing someone
muttering, "There's still another bomb inside."

A: That's a big, big issue. In fact, there is a Freedom of Information Act
lawsuit that is engaged in Oklahoma City right now in federal court, and has
been for about a year, trying to get tapes to be released.

Q: What do the FBI and Justice Department say and do?

A: They don't give any substantive reasons why they shouldn't release them.
That's the main reason it's gone on for 12 months and now is set to go to
trial in June, unless the judge all of a sudden decides to give the
government a summary judgment as they continue to ask for. There have been at
least 22 tapes that have been identified. They have not yet had to specify
what tapes they have in their possession, but we know what a lot of those are
and where they come from. One of them is from the Alfred P. Murrah Building,
right at the front of it.

Q: I remember hearing some of the reports the day after the event, and I
distinctly remember one guy screaming, "There's still another bomb inside."

A: We've got all kinds of documentation on other bombs in the building and
even some being taken out. There is one aspect of this probably a lot of
people have heard. There was an expert, a terrorism expert that was brought
into a television studio miles away from the bomb site to sit down and talk
at the news desk with two anchors about how they were really glad they had
just pulled this one bomb out of there and that they were dismantling it as
they spoke. He said that by dismantling it, it was going to help them
discover who these people were that did it and help them find them and catch
them.

Q: Charles, in the wake of stuff like that, how in the world can they still
claim, despite the abundance of data refuting it, that that one truck bomb
did all the damage?

A: I think part of the reason for that and for how they get away with this
kind of thing is it was such a climactic thing that happened. It was a
traumatic experience, and they did all of this right at the height of the
emotional trauma. Plus, when you talk about scientific-type issues like the
crater, the bomb, the ammonium nitrate bomb – I mean, how many of us would
really know whether or not an ammonium nitrate bomb could do something like
that?

Q: That's why you turn to experts like Ben Partin who do know. His detailed
statistical data analysis is compelling. It makes it very clear how that
building was brought down.

A: Yeah, and when you look at a handful of others like that, it becomes even
more compelling. These are people who have worked for NASA, people who have
had all kinds of experience and background working with ammonium nitrate
bombs, for example, in mining applications. You know there are also examples
of other terrorist acts where ammonium nitrate bombs have been used, like in
Bogata, Colombia. Then you've got the Kobar Towers bombing in Saudi Arabia,
the World Trade Center – all good examples to look at and make comparisons.

Q: WorldNetDaily is reporting that your forthcoming report contains
"information never reported in any other forum." Like what?

A: We talked to an individual about his experience at the site as a rescue
worker assisting some other law enforcement agents taking TOW missiles out of
the building in crates and also other boxes full of what he believes were
explosives like C-4 and similar types of things immediately after the
bombing. He said he was directed to take them up to some government vans, and
they were whisked away to some unknown location.

Q: Is this stuff that was allegedly squirreled away in the ATF office?

A: It wasn't actually in the office. It was down in one of the lowest level
rooms of what people called the basement but wasn't really a basement because
it was a split-level from north to south. Some people considered that first
floor a basement. There was a room that is believed to be an ATF room in
which they stored a lot of things. They actually had two rooms back there.
They were directed to take this arsenal out of there and take them up to some
vans. They were not to remember things that they saw and did. This person
talks about a couple of ATF agents who were standing there talking as these
individuals carried this stuff out in groups of two. They made comments about
when they got paged and what actually took place and what rumor or story was
circulating about who did this and about how it happened. They used some
terminology like "renegade agent." There are a number of other interesting
bits of information that nobody has ever heard of.

Q: Hurry up and finish it so I can read it, will you?

A: OK. Believe me – we're working day and night. I apologize to everyone out
there who has been waiting for it, but it is a monumental task. I don't have
a big crew of people. It's been me a lot of times, and I've got one or two
other people to help me along the way.

Q: The Operation Dipole Mite that the ATF was conducting in 1994 – it was
funded by the National Security Agency. One of their own special agents,
Harry Everheart, was confirmed to have called the Treasury Department within
20 minutes after the bombing and reported that it was an ANFO truck bomb.
What do you think about the fact the ATF was conducting it's own explosions
with ANFO and C-4 vehicle bombs less than 12 months before the building went
off? Do you think that's a coincidence?

A: No, I don't. As a matter of fact, I've got information that was given to
me by a government official – whom I won't name at this time – who told me
that his information was that the genesis of the Oklahoma City bombing ...
You wanted some new information. This is not in the report because I cannot
source this. It's just something somebody I trust very much told me. The
genesis of the Oklahoma City bombing began right after Waco as a public
relations stunt so that they would redeem themselves and look good because of
the way Waco turned out and because they were so concerned about almost being
axed from the federal tree.

Q: Whoops! If this was supposed to be their do-over ...

A: Here are some other facts that we know. Carol Howe, the ATF informant in
eastern Oklahoma, provided lots of information to the ATF office in Tulsa –
enough so that they were preparing to do a raid on certain individuals that
were residents of the Elohim City community. I don't know that all of the
people in that community were violent or part of the Oklahoma City bombing,
but some certainly were, in my opinion. And we don't know how many of those
were informants and agents for the government. But some of them were saying
we need to take our war against the government to a higher level and blow up
government buildings, assassinate politicians and start mass shootings.

Q: Is this just street talk, or is there any kind of paper trail on this
stuff?

A: These were all in government documents. I'm sitting here looking at them
as we talk. They began to put together a raid. Then the ATF found out about
five weeks before the bombing that the FBI had an informant involved. A
highway patrolman said, "You know that the FBI has their own informant in
there, don't you?" Well of course they didn't know that. The right hand
didn't know what the left hand was doing.

They immediately had a series of meetings with the head of the ATF in Tulsa,
with the U.S. attorney in Tulsa, who said they had to have a meeting with the
head of the FBI in Oklahoma City, Bob Ricks, from Waco fame. Then we find out
later, because of trial documents, that that raid was called off, probably by
the FBI – the bigger kid on the block. The FBI probably told the ATF to back
off, we have our own thing going on here. Furthermore, we know because of
this case that there was a heightened alert, that the FBI had put the fire
department, the Oklahoma County Bomb Squad and other law enforcement on
alert. Apparently, they thought they could pull this off right in Oklahoma
City and stop it.

Q: Have you been harassed, followed, suffered break-ins, anything like that?

A: Some of those things, yes. I don't know if I've been followed. I'm not
sure I'm sharp enough to pick up those folks that do that kind of thing for a
living. My harassments came publicly, because I knew instinctively that if I
was going to get involved in this I needed to become very public with my
involvement. Therefore, I got attacked publicly, and it was very intense. I
think only people that were out here in Oklahoma City that were really paying
attention can really understand and relate just how serious the attacks were.

Q: How serious were they?

A: At one point, the attorney general of the state, Drew Edmunson, tried to
charge me and two other people with violations of a law that were totally
erroneous, and they knew that. It was all for publicity, and it was right in
the middle of our petition gathering 45-day period. It was all for show and
to try to slow us down.

Q: What about Gov. Frank Keating?

A: Frank Keating was very critical. He is a very slick guy, sharp-tongued,
likes to have it both ways. He likes to say there cannot be any way that
there is any truth to any of these things about the Oklahoma City bombing,
but in the same breath he'll say, "But I don't really know everything about
the bombing, so maybe there is something."

Q: What about this ubiquitous Strassmeir character? There were entire Web
pages devoted to this guy at one point.

A: There is no question in my mind that Strassmeir either worked for our
government or with the knowledge of some of the intelligence or
law-enforcement agencies of our government. No question in my mind. And if
you read Ambrose Evans-Pritchard's book, and I suggest people get it through
WorldNetDaily. It's probably the best book out there on the Oklahoma City
bombing. Pritchard has Strassmeir do everything except come flat out and
admit that it was a sting operation that went wrong and that he clearly was
an inside player.

Q: Where is Strassmeir now?

A: The information is that he is still over in Germany living with his
parents. His father was a cabinet member in Helmut Kohl's administration,
something similar to a secretary of state, as I understand it. His background
in the German military is pretty impressive also.

Q: The contract on a Ryder truck like the one allegedly used in the bombing
states it's rated maximum weight is 3,800 pounds. The size of the ANFO bomb
kept going up and up as time passed to 4,000 pounds to the latest claims of
7,000 pounds. The truck couldn't have handled it.

A: This book that has come out about McVeigh's alleged confessions and
statements and revelations is very questionable in my opinion.

Q: What is the reaction to the mysterious geometric growth of the size of the
bomb over time?

A: The story that McVeigh allegedly tells is about the bomb being 7,000
pounds, that he forced Terry Nichols to help him build it out at Geary Lake.
Whether it's 4,000 or 7,000, the government has claimed it was a 4,380-pound
bomb. Most people don't understand the ammonium nitrate, the diesel fuel,
methane fumes, but experts will tell you you've got a potentially very, very
serious problem with all those fumes in close quarters like that. So when you
really consider that aspect of it, not to mention driving all of those many
many miles to Oklahoma City and that bomb maintaining its integrity – which
is another thing experts question – how could this really be pulled off?

Q: The fuse stories are kinda hinky, too.

A: Yes. McVeigh allegedly claims he had two fuses, a two and a half minute
and a five minute fuse, and that he sets the five minute fuse off and about
two and half minutes later he sets the other one. Come on. You're driving
through downtown, and what happens if you get stuck at a light, or you get
stuck by traffic or something like that? The whole story is pretty ridiculous
when you think it through and turn to experts and ask their opinions of all
this.

Q: Bottom line is that dog don't hunt?

A: Doesn't hunt.